Z Series The Next Generation BMW Z4 - Coming in 2018?

[Busty]

Pedestrian safety.

So Audi is exempt from pedestrian safety.... got it

It's less trivial than you assume, I guess.
Front styling including shutlines is determined by the entire hood and what's underneath in certain quadrants (and how weight distribution is, in general). Audi (and other brands building upon FWD platforms) make use of that and profit from a certain flexibility. BMW (as well as Mercedes) are often in a more tricky situation, in 'low' cars particularly.

As far as medical aspects are concerned, this article may be good starter. There are some more recent ones on design implications.
A Methodology for the Geometric Standardization of Vehicle Hoods to Compare Real-World Pedestrian Crashes

 

[klier]

Pedestrian safety.

It's going for the cheap solution is what it is. Nothing more, nothing less. Pedestrian regulations exist, but the hood shutline obviously is not required....

Front styling including shutlines is determined by the entire hood and what's underneath in certain quadrants (and how weight distribution is, in general).

I really wonder what the technical differences are below the hood for the X1 and X2 then. The X2 is much lower I guess, so the hardware could be different but I severely doubt that.

I also don't get the connection between weight distribution and hood shutliness.

 

[klier]

I really like the looks of the new Z4 btw. Everything except that shutline.

 

[DjordjeC63]

So Audi is exempt from pedestrian safety.... got it

I see no Audi on your pictures, in previous post of yours.
Hood line on concept is not good for pedestrians.

 

[Matski]

Pedestrian regulations exist, but the hood shutline obviously is not required....

Pedestrian regs are complex things.... these were images I pulled out for the X2 thread. You can see that there are a number of points along the profile where you don't want hard point and the datum of the bonnet leading edge partially defines them.

I'm not saying it's pedestrian impact regs that dictate shut lines entirely, but I don't think it can be discounted simply as a cost factor only - it's likely to be related to a number of things.

 

[klier]

I still fail to see what that all has to do with the shutline? Sorry guys

 

[SCOTT27]

The Tempura also has the shutline and separate nose cone.
Whereas pedestrian safety is one factor, the other is general safety and insurance purpose where you are effectively breaking plastic not crunching metal in a low speed impact.
Another factor is in the engineering in regards to providing the best possible positioning for the engine,firewall etc.

I hope you see why I prefer M Sport against the standard. The M Sport uses a lot lot more of the facia with more intakes and sculptured areas compared to standard edition.
The standard alloys rather than the black powder coated ones here actually make the car more purposeful in their bi-colour option.

The interior is straight from the concept with minor detail changes, but quality is excellent and it's more modern. However I do miss the CS Concept type switchgear.

 

[hoffmeister_fan]

Besides pedestrian/crash regs and insurance purposes, I imagine that coming up with a solution that would satisfy both BMW and Toyota played a role.

I'd be lying if I didn't prefer the concept's solution to the shutlines versus the production car's solution. But it doesn't deter me enough if the car drives well and interior is executed well.

But you know what does deter me? That damn reverse light! Klier has his shutline fetish, and I am willing to yell till I am blue in the face about how stupid it is to place reverse light(s) on or below a bumper so a) it's low on your sightlines whether you a driver in another car or a pedestrian, or b) it's located on something that's prone to the most impact, so it's an added cost when replacing a bumper. We all have hills we are willing to die on, reverse lights (or any lights) located on or below bumpers is mine.

 

[hovabongZA]

Supra forum seems to like the Z4 while the bimmerpost hates it. Worst BMW critics are BMW fans followed by MB and Lexus fans.

 

[Matski]

Supra forum seems to like the Z4 while the bimmerpost hates it.

Of course the other site hates it... it's what they do... it's like the human centipede of car opinions. I actually went over their to check out their poll - I accidentally read a post or two and now I'll probably end up with a mild common cold.

 

[Matski]

I still fail to see what that all has to do with the shutline? Sorry guys

It's all about where the hard bits of the car are in relation to something the car is hitting. But as I say, I don't think it's all about such regs. It must be preferable to BMW in some cases, but there must be a reason why it's not preferable in all cases.

 

[Busty]

It's going for the cheap solution is what it is. Nothing more, nothing less. Pedestrian regulations exist, but the hood shutline obviously is not required....



I really wonder what the technical differences are below the hood for the X1 and X2 then. The X2 is much lower I guess, so the hardware could be different but I severely doubt that.

I also don't get the connection between weight distribution and hood shutliness.

First, I should emphasize that this is not my primary field of expertise and that my knowledge is just based on endless design discussions (with designers, engineers, product managers) and corresponding decision processes at different OEMs. However, I did not learn these things from scratch.
Weight distribution matters as it often affects plunging. This, in turn, has an effect on where pedestrians might hit bonnet and windshield. In general, most critical body parts are to be protected best: hip/pelvis, thighs, spine, and head. Many studies show that shutlines are highly critical/hazardous regions (particularly when simulating crashes with children) because this is where rather soft and hard materials meet. Those seams cause worst injuries (because parts 'disconnect' and react differently) and, by the way, shutline 'scenarios' are hard to simulate and outcomes are difficult to predict. I often had the impression that shutline choices were mostly based on simulation outcomes. And the underlying models include numerous variables. So, as mentioned above, I think this is a very complex topic. Costs may play a role ... but, based on my experience, they are not everything.

I'm in a hurry right now, sorry. If there is no real expert in here and there is further need for deeper information, I will search for some articles by the end of the week.

 

[BMW3GT]

Of course the other site hates it... it's what they do... it's like the human centipede of car opinions. I actually went over their to check out their poll - I accidentally read a post or two and now I'll have to go for chemotherapy.

I'm neither a mod nor I want to be the stereotypical german that doesn't get a joke but a good friend of mine has finally done his last treatment after a
Hodgkin's lymphoma. He is in a very bad physical condition but the treatments did help. Chemotherapy is pure hell. The very last thing is it should be quoted in a joke.

 

[klier]

Good to hear it helped, and we all here wish your friend all the best in his recovery. At least he has some of the very best doctors in the world, being in Germany.

F'ing cancer

 

[Matski]

I'm neither a mod nor I want to be the stereotypical german that doesn't get a joke but a good friend of mine has finally done his last treatment after a
Hodgkin's lymphoma. He is in a very bad physical condition but the treatments did help. Chemotherapy is pure hell.

I know, six years ago I watched my 70 year old diabetic and arthritic mother go through it, also for Lymphoma.

The very last thing is it should be quoted in a joke.

Chemotherapy isn't the target of the 'joke', nor are oncology patients, Bimmerpost is... I do not feel that what I said comes at the expense of anyone elses dignity, and doesn't reinforce or normalize negative stereotypes, biases or prejudices, and is not a personal attack - it was simply an exercise in exaggeration and contrast. I will censor my previous post since you've taken issue with it, however I fundamentally believe not being able to even address even the treatment in a light-hearted conversational situation is a very poor reaction to dealing with something that absolutely should not be a taboo subject and is borderline denial.

FWIW I hope your friend makes an appropriate recovery.

 

[EKaru]

It's going for the cheap solution is what it is. Nothing more, nothing less. Pedestrian regulations exist, but the hood shutline obviously is not required....

That's exactly what it is... It facilitates the manufacturing process of attaching the front clip with the body.

https://c2.staticflickr.com/2/1792/43973149662_442a4238ef_o.gif

Animated GIF - Find & Share on GIPHY

 

[CrunchSlaughtered]

So, it turns out that the X2 is cheaper than the X1 and not the other way around

 

[Betty Swollocks]

But you know what does deter me? That damn reverse light! Klier has his shutline fetish, and I am willing to yell till I am blue in the face about how stupid it is to place reverse light(s) on or below a bumper so a) it's low on your sightlines whether you a driver in another car or a pedestrian, or b) it's located on something that's prone to the most impact, so it's an added cost when replacing a bumper. We all have hills we are willing to die on, reverse lights (or any lights) located on or below bumpers is mine.

I'm pretty sure it's not the reverse light. It's the fog light. The reverse lights will be integrated within the main rear lights. As you say, it would be stupid to put the reverse light so low down, so I'm sure it would be against regulations anyway.

 

[Matski]

That's exactly what it is... It facilitates the manufacturing process of attaching the front clip with the body.

Personally I don't think this answers the question. There's nothing to stop them from mounting the noses on the cars the same way with the shutline along the top of the kidneys, infact, at the start of this video here is the old F25 X3 (whose shutline was above the kidneys)...

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and here's them doing the same thing with the G11 7-er

 

[cawimmer430]

It looks rather small and compact in these leaked photos, but I’ve seen the camouflaged versions up-close in my city and they’re actually quite large. And they look good for sure. This is a nice design - athletic and muscular.

Also, yesterday I was in a parking lot when suddenly the 3rd generation BMW 1-Series showed up, heavily camouflaged of course. I wanted to snap some photos with my phone but as it was raining heavily I thought twice about it. I remember the rear window of the 1er being rather steep and straight - unless the camouflage has something underneath it to give this impression.